Thursday, June 11, 2009

Aloha, Yo!

Today is Kamehameha Day, honoring King Kamehameha of Hawaii. Do something to celebrate the occasion! I don't know, just do something, roast a pig or eat pineapple, watch Is It Fall Yet? Go wild!

More soon. It's soon!

The courageous Disco316 has taken up the unenviable task of finding and listing all NC-17 Daria stories (Dariarotica). His list is on SFMB somewhere. If you can't find it, you're not supposed to find it. Some works are borderline but fit more into the conventional listing (e.g., "Embers" and "Love Is a Series of Burning Sensations," both by Undefinedlust, which is what I said in the first place). If you have an opinion on what constitutes Dariarotica, particularly which works should be in which list, post your thoughts here.

30 comments:

Anonymous said...

Just a question: where did all the artists on PPMB go? It's like they were abducted by aliens....

undefinedlust said...

heh both Embers and LSBS are mine...

I wouldn't say that either remotely resembles Dariarotica(To be fair, LSBS may have one scene in the future that might be borderline) but what do I know.

I won best Gay/Lesbian Erotica for a kiss last year it wasn't Dariarotica either, nor was it a good story. Out of what was nominated, anything else should have won, but I would go with Respite's Write Me In... so I have no clue what people consider Dariarotica.

brnleague99 said...

TAG, "Love Is A Series Of Burning Sensations" was written by undefinedlust, not legendeld.

Just sayin'. I should know...that's one of three fics that keeps me going.

In case you care, the other two are "Wristcutters: A Daria Story" by Charliefox2012 and your "Gimme Skelter" are the other two.

Gouka Ryuu said...

I would figure the day was in honor of Goku and his signature move. :P

The Angst Guy said...

I AM NEVER WRONG! NEVER! OFF WITH YOUR HEADS!!!

The Angst Guy said...

I might have been misinformed, however. Brandon, this is all your fault.

brnleague99 said...

I blame the poor grammar in my previous post on being half distracted by the Golden Girls on TV. However, I blame TAG's misinformation on sloppy research! SLOPPY RESEARCH, I TELLS YE!

undefinedlust said...

no big TAG, I just don't want poor Legendled getting blamed for my drivel. Thankfully It looks like Embers and LSBS are not listed as NC 17/Erotica or whatever. I would be waaay beyond disturbed if anyone actually considered Embers to be erotic. Hell if I thought anyone was turned on by it I would delete it and never write anything even close ever again.

Anonymous said...

It would appear that it's about time for me to go. It's been fun...

brnleague99 said...

Anonymous...I agree. We need S.C., Christ Oliver and Kemical Reaxion now more than ever.

Anonymous said...

As a general rule, I'd mark erotic anything that indulged in colorful descriptions of body parts (as opposed to just using straight-up clinical names) or invoked first-hand descriptions of below-the-waist action.

Disco316 said...

It's hard to say what is and isn't Dariarotica in some cases, especially when non-sexual nudity or borderline descriptions of activities arise. I'm half-tempted to write an essay on the subject or, at the very least, a wiki article for it.

And if I don't, assume that my attempts at writing about Dariarotica worked as well as my attempts to write Dariarotica itself.

undefinedlust said...

Well, let's start with a basic definition of terms.

From the Concise Oxford English dictionary:

erotic

/irottik/

• adjective relating to or tending to arouse sexual desire or excitement.

— DERIVATIVES erotically adverb.

— ORIGIN Greek erotikos, from eros ‘sexual love’.

I think it would be grossly unfair to put work that treats sexuality in a realistic, intelligent manner that is not intend to arouse in the same class as something that, in the words of the most recent SCOTUS definition of obscenity, "taken as a whole, appeals to the prurient interest".

My fear is that if a definition of erotica is decided that would include any realistic treatment of sexuality the work like mine would be rather easily banned from PPMB and perhaps relegated to the locked section of SFMB.

I have no quarrel with those works, many are quite interesting, but I would protest that LSBS (or especially Embers) has nothing in common with most of what is there.


Just my $.02

brnleague99 said...

.02? UL, you cheap bastard. We demand .03 here at the Daria Blog. You knew the rules when we let you in! *grin*

undefinedlust said...

I thought that was $.03 Canadian...

undefinedlust said...

I shouldn't let this bother me, but it does... a lot...

I did not set out to write anything remotely erotic with Embers and I have definitely tried to write LSBS in such a way that sexuality was handled appropriately yet honestly.

Believe it or not the intent of LSBS was never to provide shock value, but to do a realistic D/J story. I never intended it to be considered borderline erotica. (or borderline NC 17 for that matter. I thought of it as at most borderline R, if that.)

Crap, now I wonder if I shouldn't rethink things significantly or maybe move it to SFMB or something. I don't know....

Disco316 said...

Trust me, LSBS hasn't crossed the line at PPMB. Maybe it can be argued that it is Dariarotica, but that's a completely seperate qualification from whether it's appropriate for PPMB.

Adult content, certainly. Erotica, maybe. Pornography, no.

Embers certainly contains adult content as well, but again, it's certainly within PPMB standards.

Easiest way to determine if it's too iffy for PPMB is to post it with a disclaimer and see how people respond. (Assuming it's questionable which side of the line it's on.) If people say you went too far, remove it and put it up elsewhere.

the bug guy said...

UL, your stories are not a problem at PPMB. The cutoff is graphic descriptions of sex acts or nudity.

And if you have any questions, you can PM me or any other mod you feel comforable with and ask if something is okay.

undefinedlust said...

Thanks Disco and Bug Guy. I have asked opinions about suitability for PPMB on LSBS and gotten answers that it was fine.

I don't think I expressed myself well about what bothered me (I'm extremely sick with ear and sinus infections, so I am not shocked I didn't get it across right, or if I am oversensitive at the moment)

What bothered me was the idea that people might consider what I am doing to be erotica. Unfortunately Erotica has become a marginalized art form in all areas, not just fandoms. I have no problems with erotica, and were I to write something on a Henry Miller or Anaïs Nin level I would be proud of the accomplishment.

I guess what frustrated me is that I am really trying hard to make LSBS something other than a story about sex. Yes I have included a whole lot of sexuality, but I don't think you could honestly tell this kind of story without it.

That being said, we see all the comments on the D/J ship about it being the byproduct of horny net geeks wanting to see and write hot lesbo action or something to that effect, and that is absolutely not what I am trying to do at all.

Then again, I am sure that is obvious. I am at about 60k words and maybe 2k are even remotely close to erotica (I wouldn't say they are, but still..).

Its just frustrating, I know full well that essentially any story that treats sexuality seriously runs the risk of being labled porn, but it still sucks when you worry that your intention or vision may be being clouded by the label.

The Angst Guy said...

Erotic? You couldn't possibly know erotic. In March of the Penguins, all those males huddling together for warmth, rubbing against each other, itt maks me s ssosos exxxixitifiad
elfw

arjgq
fga

the bug guy said...

NP, I was only addressing the technical end.

Handling sex in a story can be trick business and people will read into it what they want. Apparently they'll read a lot into it when it involves two girls...

Disco316 said...

So to paraphrase: "I didn't mean to turn you on." =)

For more about accidental on-turning, see: http://www.mst3kinfo.com/ward_e/Bit907a.html

(Note, perfectly safe for work)

undefinedlust said...

Again,

Thanks for the positive feedback... I think being under the weather has a lot to do with how I reacted to this. Obviously, I can't control how people see what I write, and yes LSBS does, and will until it's conclusion, deal with sexuality. To a point, I wouldn't be horrified with LSBS being considered erotica I suppose, but its still not the point.

I think part of what may make LSBS seem borderline is the general realism of the piece. I'm trying to portray all the characters as real people, not cartoons (to the point where when I am writing it I don't imagine anyone animated, but what their real world counterparts would look like).

I have based almost every incident in the story on the stories of people I have known, and the characters themselves are an amalgamation of canon and bits of several people I have known.

Perhaps that makes the sexuality, violence, profanity and drug use all the more borderline.

The wierd thing is if I were younger I would revel in the potential shock value, heck if I felt good I might have found being an a NC 17 list funny. I can only imagine how much controversy this would have stirred up in the old days of the fandom when canon purists and 'shippers and the angsty sorts and all of that warred. I probably wouldn't have worried as much about offending back then! :)

Brother Grimace said...

Hmm... what is erotica?

Don't know. Never got involved with the genre.

The Angst Guy said...

I'm sorry, Bro, but this is for your own good.

[slaps BG]

I did not mean to set off a powderkeg over the erotica issue. The only real Dariarotica I ever mentioned on DFB2 was SSJ04-Mewtwo's stuff on FF.net, and I won't worry about it any more since Disco316 is handling that. (Thank you!) The non-erotic stories he does will be mentioned here, though.

brnleague99 said...

BG, erotica is written fiction that makes one feel "happy in the pants". Please don't make me describe "happy in the pants" as Mom and Dad should have explained that at age 12. *smirk*

The Kristen Bealer Guy said...

I did not mean to set off a powderkeg over the erotica issue.

Oh, yes you did! You're just trying to beat my record comment count! :p

the bug guy said...

See TAG, you can get a good response count. Just use sex!

:)

I would consider stories that are plot driven with good characterization that include sexual material to be erotica. I mean a real plot, not a series of excuses to get characters in bed, that's Dariaporn.

The Angst Guy said...

Dariaporn.... we need a page on that at DariaWiki. OMG, we don't even have a page on Dariarotica! Do I have to do EVERYTHING around here?

The Angst Guy said...

BTW, Kristen Bealer Guy: your record is going down in flames.